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Going to the Netherlands

Submitted by Jakob on 25 May, 2006 - 12:42.My Blog | Travel

My Internet connection is down and has been down since Tuesday which is why I haven't posted in three days. I'm quite annoyed with the way my ISP handles it, it seems their tech support is taking the holiday and weekend off, so nothing will be done until Monday when I'll be in the Netherlands.

Yep, that's right, me and several other cog sci students from Link�ping are going to Nijmegen in the Netherlands to visit our friend-program there. We take turns seeing each other, last spring they were here and I was head of the committee organizing the reception so I'm looking forward to seeing them all again. I have no doubts we will have a great time and I'll finally get to see Amsterdam. This is not my first time in the Netherlands but I've never really stopped there, just been traveling through.

Some foreigners say the Dutch and Swedish are similar and that's probably true to some extent, at least what the languages' phonemes are concerned. Hearing Dutch is extremely bewildering as you recognize the phonemes (the pieces of sounds a language consists of) but you can't make any sense of them!

The Dutch have a worldwide reputation for their liberal drug laws, allowing marijuana. I have a rather strict view on drugs, perhaps even conservative. While I drink alcohol I believe marijuana should be banned and that it is a far more dangerous drug than people would like to think. Even though smoking it twice a year won't kill you or may not even cause any serious brain damage there are some rather dangerous side effects, such as retrips, and having one of those while driving will probably kill you, so marijuana certainly kills but not directly.

I look forward to a great week in the Netherlands and I'll stay in touch and post here whenever I get to access a computer.



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Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on 31 May, 2006 - 23:57.

I'm Dutch and I don't use any drugs (that includes alcohol).

You say that your are conservative on the use of drugs but you do drink alcohol, which is a far worse drug then marijuana. That seems a bit hypocritical to me.

By taking a quite harmless drug like marijuana out of the illegal circuit we are able to focus all our attention on the real drug problems.

From Wikipedia:

"In contrast with most countries' policies, the Dutch policy has yielded positive results in the war against drugs. The Netherlands spends more than 130 million annually on facilities for addicts, of which about fifty percent goes to drug addicts. The Netherlands has extensive demand reduction programs, reaching about ninety percent of the country's 25,000 to 28,000 hard drug users. The number of hard drug addicts has stabilized in the past few years and their average age has risen to 38 years. The number of drug-related deaths in the country remains the lowest in Europe."

Contrary to popular believe, we also consume alot less marijuana then most EU countries. And the people who do consume it here are guaranteed of good quality instead of getting it in some back alley from a drug dealer who probably also sells the more serious drugs.

From Wikipedia:

"Despite the legalization of soft drugs, use of cannabis in the Netherlands is not higher than most other countries in Western Europe: 9.7% of young males consume cannabis at least once a month, which rates the Netherlands 7th in the EU after Cyprus (23.3%), Spain (16.4%), United Kingdom (15.8%), France (13.2%), Italy (10.9%) and Germany (9.9%)."

I'm not saying that the Dutch policy is the holy grail but it's important to let the facts speak for themselves and not just be against it because 'drugs are bad'.

Have fun :).

Submitted by Jakob on 3 June, 2006 - 22:24.

Thank you for your post. It's always nice to debate these issues.

I am aware that alcohol is a dangerous drug but there are a few aspects of it that you seem to ignore.

1. Alcohol is well researched, which means we know a lot more about how it affects the body. Marijuana and cannabis are wildcards which have been shown to negatively affect the neurosystem and cause permanent damage as well as being highly addictive. I cannot see how anyone sane can legalize a drug we know so extremely little about. Using cannabis is serious risk-taking since we know that it's harmful however how and to what extent is being debated and the potheads who enter the debate with unscientific arguments aren't making things easier.

2. Most people can control their use of alcohol, and to further enforce that Sweden has rather restricting laws regarding the selling of alcoholic beverages. Regular, responsible use of alcohol doesn't cause any of the damage you see in people that smoke pot with the same frequency.

3. Alcohol is an integral part of our culture, unlike marijuana, and banning it is practically impossible. Alcoholic beverages include wine and beer, beverages appreciated for their qualities what flavors are concerned, not just because they are intoxicating. Cannabis has no place in our Western culture whatsoever and in parts of the world where use of drugs, cannabinoids or other, were part of the culture they were subject to religious and ceremonial rituals that limited the potential abuse. None of these control mechanisms exist in our society today and cannabis has no qualities other than its intoxication so it's not something the majority would miss.

Secondly, I very much reject using Wikipedia as a reference for controversial data. It cannot be trusted and since this is a debated topic there's no telling whether the facts you just found are indeed facts or just propagande from the pothead camp.

Submitted by Gordman (not verified) on 26 July, 2007 - 10:02.
Well this is becoming a troubling issue, i totally am AGAINST drug legalization. Why? I have seen too much, it's hard to face drug effects, it's hard to deal whit victims and the list goes on. I guess authorities have a bad way of spending their money fighting drugs. We need to have more drug treatment centers, most of them are full and daily overwhelmed whit new patients who come for treatment. Also, we need a direct campaign campaign, tell people the truth about drug abuse, let addicts speak laud.
Submitted by Jakob on 26 July, 2007 - 12:18.

It's a hard issue and something that divides even the most liberally minded. I am for a socially responsible attitude and policy and I consider it reckless to abuse drugs due to the costs drug addiction is causing society, costs that are not just financial but emotional as well.

While I believe the individual must have the right to make his/her own choices there are limits, especially regarding choices where the outcome is unknown. Just like we cannot forbid people from committing suicide if they so choose, we cannot forbid them from attempting to reach the summit of Mount Everest (which is very dangerous) - after all it is their life and their choice.

As in the case of drugs, the costs are not carried by the individual only but by society as a whole and choice and responsibility go hand in hand. Furthermore, as I have pointed out, making a responsible decision regarding the usage of drugs is almost impossible since we know relatively little about how drugs affect us.

In the end, it stands to reason. A society without any drugs would likely be extremely boring. A society that is flooded with drugs, the kind of drugs that can lead to death and which are highly addictive, would be a nightmare.

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